College should be tuition free

May 1, 2016, 10:34 pm

Agree72 Disagree54

57%
43%

The debate "College should be tuition free" was started by dalton7532 on May 1, 2016, 10:34 pm. By the way, dalton7532 is disagreeing with this statement. 72 people are on the agree side of this discussion, while 54 people are on the disagree side. That might be enough to see the common perception. It looks like most of the people in this community are on the agreeing side of this statement.

dalton7532 posted 1 argument, Nemiroff posted 46 arguments, historybuff posted 3 arguments, SwaggerPoptart posted 1 argument to the agreers part.
RyanWakefield posted 1 argument, TZW posted 41 arguments, dalton7532 posted 4 arguments, Claystation posted 1 argument, LawfulOne posted 1 argument, SwaggerPoptart posted 1 argument, Alex posted 1 argument to the disagreers part.

Nemiroff, Danier, historybuff, styletile, Theswimmer, Roger444, Naidu, confident, mohasan, Max, moneybagboyz123, SueAnnMohr, JGM, laurafuna, Daffa8799, mtdc_17, peaceguy, beatrice, arisa, Zuhayr, charlieholmes, nellie11iah and 50 visitors agree.
sagitario, TZW, dalton7532, bigB, rahmatali7619, Rogersgirl75, Claystation, Austin7779, SwaggerPoptart, LawfulOne, sabrina, Alex, ototoxic, rawblood, DB8101, Soles, whiteguy, ell, jack_tim_45, moneybagboyz and 34 visitors disagree.

I agree college should he free tuition. But then college entrance exams should me much harder and you must prove yourself to be intelligent enough to not be a waste of the college's resources and drop out.

3 years, 3 months ago

with a better educated population we can expand those industries and start to steal all the worthwhile jobs from the rest of the world.

all the companies, r&d, and even accounting will be outsourced to us while their citizens can handle all the labor.

3 years, 4 months ago
dalton7532
replied to...

It is no longer a promise if you go to college you will get the job you want. The chances of getting a job you want are already very slim, and just image 100% more competition in the industry of your choice.

3 years, 4 months ago
dalton7532
replied to...

If we make college tuition free, there will be more workers available for a certain job that requires college experience, and and it would make it likely harder for you to get a job that you want since there is more competition in the workplace. If we also make colleges free by subsidizing them, the prices would rise exponentially of colleges and the quality of education would sink. This was the same case when we subsidized health insurance companies. I think we can avoid making college free and resolve these issues by creating better pre-12 education and making better and higher paying jobs that do not require college. That is my opinion, and I am happy to discuss this.

3 years, 4 months ago
PoliticsAsUsual
replied to...

why would it be bad for every Tom sick and Harry to get in?
not that that would happen.

3 years, 4 months ago

after reading all that my fellows have posted, I have come to believe that college tuition shouldn't become free. Simply so as to reserve it's value and not make it the job of any Tom sick and Harry to get in. once that happens, it will be a step down for colleges.

3 years, 4 months ago

If government budget was manageable and enough to provide tuition free, then we the dream would come true. By the way, we should raise taxes for the 1% and the riches but not be too far as the laffer curve and the index is calculated....

3 years, 4 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

reform the tax system, make it so Warren buffet doesn't pay less % taxes than his secretary.

create a progressive capital gains tax which is where most of the 0.01%'s wealth comes from (and this will allow ordinary people to have easier access to invest as well)

monitor corruption and eliminate waste in the government. corruption steals money from the people. eliminate it and we can lower spending on services without affecting any of those services.

increase minimum wage and eliminate most government assistance. highly profitable corporations do not need payroll welfare, small businesses need customers with spending power for their own survival.)

3 years, 5 months ago

someone tell me where the money would come from (the US is in a bit of debt btw).

I'll give you an idea, if you fail to give a money source that is constitutional and will work.

3 years, 5 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

your right, nothing is free.
however if you spend nothing, you achieve nothing.

like you said, middle and high school are not free, do you think we would be stronger with an illiterate population that can't do basic math?

no high end jobs? well currently 3rd world countries are stealing all our low wage, do you want to fight for those jobs and compete who can pay their workers the least (I don't think Indonesian citizens have quite the same rent costs)

or should we invest in education and start stealing all of those countries high end, we'll paying, a pleasure to work in jobs (instead of dying in coal mines or slowly from maladies aquired in those mines)

which do you think will make America greater?

3 years, 5 months ago
SwaggerPoptart
replied to...

*knocking*

3 years, 5 months ago

Nothing is free. Grade school, Middle school and High School aren't free, they are paid from taxes... which btw is at an all time high as it is.

Free College means higher tax rates.
Higher tax rates means less available money to stimulate the ecomony.
Less available money means... you most likly wont even be able to get into the field you earn your "free" degree in.

Like anything else in the world, "you get what you pay for"

If your someone who desires "free" college its simply because your too young and/or ignorant to understand domestic ecomonics and the effects something like this truly will have.

3 years, 5 months ago

oh alright

3 years, 5 months ago

why would it? you would still need to qualify to get info university? besides which, university degrees are already losing their value. there are places where you need a $30,000 degree to make a bit better than minimum wage. post secondary schooling is almost mandatory now if you don't want to flip burgers. it is rediculous to force people to give up their financial well being in order to have a future.

3 years, 5 months ago

Just a question, not taking a side. If college is tuition free, won't a degree in the workplace lose its value?

3 years, 5 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

did investing in primary and highs schools hurt us? is the fact that our people are literate and capable of math make us weaker?

3 years, 6 months ago
Claystation
replied to...

College should not be tuition free. everyone should pay for college unless provided scholarships. If college were free for everyone, taxes would raise dramatically and requirements for jobs would change dramatically.

3 years, 6 months ago

I actually have a degree. But from your response I can assume you don't. I also know when I do cite you still say I'm not. So would you like me to tell you how stupid you are in APA or MLA format?

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

considering your inability to cite properly I'm assuming that you did not. that is the first thing they teach you

the other alternative is that you were promptly kicked out for academic dishonesty due to your inability to cite.

3 years, 6 months ago

You didn't go to college did you?

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

yes, but those scolarships are limited and given to the exceptional. they may have weird criteria, but only those who are exceptional in those criteria will get it...

your still stuck with them being for the very few and not your average student.

3 years, 6 months ago

You can get a scholarship for the strangest things, where does becoming a genius have to be implemented into that? Actually look up scholarships. Granted the weird ones are not a full ride scholarship but some money is better then no money.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

I said that. scholarships are for the exceptional few. that is what they were made for.

grants are for the adequate but poor, and is far less efficient use of tax dollars than public college for all

3 years, 6 months ago

"Many students do not go out and apply for scholarships or look at the ones that they are likely eligible for." -me

Where does that say you have to be a genius to get one? Or even remotely intelligent?

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

sure, you don't have to be a genius to get into college, but you do have to be one to get a scholarship which is what you brought up yourself.

read.

3 years, 6 months ago

You don't have to be a genius to get into college though? You may not get to Harvard but harvard isn't mean for everybody, or even most people for that fact. Not all scholarships are funded by the school (most aren't funded by the school) It's as simple as doing the work.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

grants and scholarships can be used for very expensive private colleges who use these hands off payment methods to raise tuition insanely high (as has been the trend for decades). paying for as full community, city, or a state College is still cheaper than paying a fraction of a private college.

scholarships are private funds that schools use to attract talent that wouldn't be able to go otherwise. it's meant for the 1 out of 1,000 prodigies like Carson who were complete losers as as kid and whose life was completely devoted to school. you don't need to be a genius to be an accountant, and it shouldn't be only the no life geniuses who get to succeed. From the well off, almost every half baked student will make it to some degree, even if it isn't surgeon, I feel that every income group should be entitled to a decent education for all the ones that study reasonably, not just the no life exceptions.

even if your poor, the average student should be able to succeed. the lazy should get nothing, but you shouldn't have to be a rare genius to make it into some sort of degree program.

3 years, 6 months ago

So what you are implying is that it's better to have tax dollars go to all of the college instead of a portion?

And what about scholarships? Many students do not go out and apply for scholarships or look at the ones that they are likely eligible for. Why aid students who don't put in the effort?

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

until you figure out how to debate properly there is little that discussing things with you will accomplish.

I'm not the one who responded to requests for a proper citation with condescending remarks about spoon feeding.

btw, grants are also tax dollars, which often go to private institutions who eagerly raise tuition since many students don't even see the full bill. same happened with medical costs, when was the last time you saw a price list at your doctor, they can charge anything since you don't care to even ask for costs.

your grant strategy is the dumbest and costliest approach we can possibly do. it will only balloon the tax burden and increase beuracracy and paperwork. free public college is the most good for the people and the least costly on the people.

3 years, 6 months ago

I made a valid point that you neglected about grants and scholarships. You keep dragging it out. So either make a point or close your app.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

do you want a biscuit for saying something clearly?

I pointed out the post that was unclear, not my fault your reaction is some attempt at a sarcastic comeback.

stop being a troll.

3 years, 6 months ago

Me saying there are grants and scholarships to help for college is not clear?

3 years, 6 months ago

Do you not think there are grants or scholarships? Do I really need to cite that or are you just upset and throwing a tantrum again?

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

cite your references PROPERLY
make your points CLEAR
that is the bare minimum for any intellectual discussion, and you fail on both counts.

I am not assuming anything, I'm just trying to teach your stubborn incompetent self. LEARN.

this has nothing to do with politics or your views, just your inability to debate properly.

3 years, 6 months ago

You don't have to be rich to get into college, in fact many students are eligible for grants and scholarships that they just don't take advantage of. If you're the average person who skipped math 3 times a week and complain that you don't have a well paying job now, is no one's fault. That's your own fault. High school is a check the block, you show up, do the work and you should never get below a 95%. Then you just have to remember whatever you were taught for the exam. Which typically an exam in high school isn't worth the majority of your grade.

So you show up do the work, and listen. You're already half way there. If your ACT/SAT isn't exactly where you need it, all you have to do is hit the minimum for college acceptance. There are hundreds of ways to save on college that people don't do because they want it handed to them. In the state I grew up all you needed was a 3.0 GPA and 21 on the ACT and you automatically were eligible for a $10,000 scholarship a year. You just had to apply.

People just aren't doing their research nor the work and then complain they don't have anything. They don't have anything because they have never done anything.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

.... are you stupid?
quote where I assumed it was directed at me.
I asked you who that was in response to. I didn't assume anything....

maybe your the one who needs to read and think.

3 years, 6 months ago

again, getting into a university and paying for university are two completely separate issues. you don't seem to be able to grasp that.

3 years, 6 months ago

You never actually put two things together. If you actually read the debate you'll know what is meant in response to you, and what is not. It's not my fault you think everything said is directed towards you. News flash, the world doesn't care about you. The sooner you realize that, the better off you will be. If it didn't fit the context of what you had to say, it wasn't meant for you. That's probably why you want free college, you didn't do well enough in high school to get in one.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

I'm going to assume your a baby boomer due to your reaction when I brought them up last time.

your really living up to the lazy and self entitled stereotype of that generation.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

if debating with you is going to turn into a second job I'm done. Its your job to make your points clear. I'm not here to deal with incompetence.

you want me to think, say something though provoking.

3 years, 6 months ago
TZW
replied to...

Just think and you should be able to figure it out.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

I'm not sure what or who this is in response.... reply button.

3 years, 6 months ago

Anyone can be accepted into a community college.

3 years, 6 months ago

immigrants can shovel their way into citizenship so their children can get a great education.

3 years, 6 months ago

you would still need to get into to university. if you can't get high enough marks in high school to get into university then it won't matter if it's free. the only way your argument makes any sense is if you assume that every who is born poor should have to push a shovel. and if that is what you believe then you are a piece of shit.

3 years, 6 months ago

when everyone in the country has a degree, who pushes the shovel and who points the finger? and how long would it take to need another 4 years to recreate the tier system again?

3 years, 6 months ago

There would be an influx bigb, look at a lot of the students who did psychology. Now a lot of those positions are filled and people get stuck working front desk at a bank.

3 years, 6 months ago
QueenQuirks
replied to...

Maybe that's where your from Bigb because there are a lot of people willing to work for anything. look at all the homeless in the streets.

3 years, 6 months ago
dalton7532
replied to...

That makes sense.

3 years, 6 months ago

The stance of cheating comes from me, I'm not going to spend my tax dollars on free education for people to cheat through it, as for funding it by other means I have thought of a simple way.

The simple way is the legalization of Marajuana, people use it regardless of its legality. It would also help provide revenue to add in another scholarship much like the lottery scholarship that most states have. If that were the case I would have no issues since it wouldn't be tax dollars.

3 years, 6 months ago

I agree with you, socialization is not the savor people think it is. Creating better jobs and pre-college education could help. I do have a question I've been asking myself recently; is it possible our society has become too educated for our own good? What I mean by that is through observation I've noticed people will not work if they think it's beneath them. It seems like people would rather complain about not having a job rather than working while looking for a better job.

Like what many millenials want today, "free tuition". But if 80 million people had college education wouldn't there be an influx in certain fields? and finding a job in your field of study would be harder, so wouldn't you have to go for a masters degree to find a job?
I think you're right on your points Dalton

3 years, 6 months ago

We do things different than other countries. That is not a bad thing. We have the smartest people in the world, we have the best technology in the world, we have the biggest economy, and we have the best medicine. Yes, we have issues, but look at the rest of the world. Socializing everything should not and is not the answer to fixing our problems.

3 years, 6 months ago

It is a pointless debate that is going on bigB. Free college is not a great idea. There are so many better solutions. If we do find a way to pay for college, there would be a massive influx of students attending any college, and the quality would drop dramtically of colleges all around, and prices would rise dramatically on colleges. Therefore, taxes would be raised too. If we create better jobs and better pre-college education, this issue would be non-existent.

3 years, 6 months ago

I'am not in this whole "cheating" debate with y'all. But I do have to ask; How are we (United States tax payer) going to pay for free tuition for about 80 million people? The United States Budget Committee in 2011 released documents on the 83 welfare programs, the welfare programs took up 1.03 trillion dollars. That's more than Social Security, Medicare, or national defense. In 2014 the United States took in 3 trillion dollars but spent 3.5 trillion in the same year. It's 2016 and I'm sure welfare programs have grown since 2011. So how will the tax payer pay for it? Including this year, 45.3 percent of the population did not pay federal income tax.

Even if you took all the money from the 1 percent, the government could only run for less than a year. So it will fall to the middle class (more tax burden) How can we sustain a nation?

3 years, 6 months ago

You can even take the most prestigious school in America, Harvard, and you'll find 250 students tried to take home the final exam to cheat on it. It's easy to have the highest scores when most of the schools is cheating.

3 years, 6 months ago

http://www.thebestschools.org/features/100-best-universities-in-world-today/

out of the top 10, only #4 and #10 are not in the US

3 years, 6 months ago

You can even speak with foreigners about our education and they say it is easy. If our education was so good do you think that we would keep getting beat years after years in technology, economics, etc. I have seen other sites that say Singapore, japan, and south Korea are top 3 in the world. The striking alarm in all of them, is it depends on where the article is published.

We can take facts though. The average phone user uses android, which is an Asian made and developed phone. The most common vehicle is the toyota corolla which is also an Asian made and developed vehicle. The ESA is begging to pass NSAA in space fair.

Is Americans college that much better? If you take what we have been giving it's a lot of failures. They're easy but ranked high because students cheat and that's why USNEWS will say, "look how good we have done." Ignore the people who didn't do anything to earn it, as well as the US can't develope anything for itself anymore.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

we have more of the most prestigious universities in the world. that's how they measured it.

3 years, 6 months ago

actually if you read into it, you'll see their methodology isn't even based off of how the school does as a whole.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

sorry you finally learned how to do research.

as I said, our precollege education is horrible. I am talking about college and higher where we excel.

your page shows both college and pre college.

my page only compares colleges.

that's why they are different. my point stands.

3 years, 6 months ago

took a little longer because you need iy spoon fed to you. but

http://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/best-education

Odd the same site displays contradicting things isn't it? The us has more colleges people want to go to because Americans aren't told what they have to study unlike a lot of Asian countries. the Study you posted is reputation, a Chinese student who is allowed to pick their own class is going to enjoy it more then back home being told what to learn.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

our college and up education level is top notch. that's a fact.

http://www.usnews.com/education/best-global-universities/articles/2015/10/06/map-countries-that-topped-the-2016-best-global-universities-rankings

3 years, 6 months ago

Compare the US education to other countries, it's lacking.

My previous assumption was 100% correct, saying that nothing is free, so that being said I can see why you want free college. You didn't put in the work during high school and middle school now you want other people to pick up your slack.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

and it's completely responsible.
if your projected returns are greater then interest, it would be dumb not to do it.
irresponsibility would be defaulting. which so far has not been a problem.

education has always been the most valuable investment. the returns will be massive. the first nation to do this will likely be the next superpower.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

about as close as all your previous assumptions. lol

3 years, 6 months ago

It's irresponsible, let me guess you are between the ages of 12-20 currently in school maybe just got ouy and not certain on how you will pay for college and looking at your peers you see some of them have higher scores compared to you, making it more uneasy about your college plans. how close was i?

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

American graduates, whether they cheat or not, are very successful in their careers compared to other nations. our high school and under education is horrible when compared to other countries, but our colleges are top notch, as are our graduates.

and it is called investment. even if you take a loan out. America has not defaulted on its debt and been a very responsible borrower. AAA rating, giving us extremely low interest rates.

3 years, 6 months ago

It's not free by the way, you still pay for it, for family pays for it, everyone pays for education that will just have a person cheat to get through.

3 years, 6 months ago

If you have no money it's not called investing, it's called poor financial decisions. If a normal person did what America did with their funds they would be audited but why allow the US to do the same? That's digging a a larger hole in hopes you'll pop out the other side soon.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

I'm saying spending money for this purpose will be benefiting to the nation. I made no judgement regarding legalization or fund raising here.

I support legalization, we can also undo the bush/Clinton tax cuts and deregulations that got us into this mess as well. the taxes would also raise funds, while regulations will stop the destabilization of our economy.

3 years, 6 months ago

So basically what you told me is if the rest of the US did what Colorado did (legalize weed) then the state wouldn't earn enough money to help with college? Even though the state of Colorado gives money back to their cities due to the increased money. You're saying that, even though states with lottery tickets that give out the lottery scholarship, still don't have enough money to help even though they are?

I'm not saying it has to be the legalization of drugs to spark free education, but Americans need to shape up and something has to offset costs.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

subsidizing colleges with federal grants, just like subsiding medicine with Medicare causes skyrocketing prices and out of control costs on the tax payer.

funding public colleges is much cheaper and allows much more control of spending.

3 years, 6 months ago

You can't make investments while you're broke. For example you won't go buy a car when you are $35,000 in debt. You have to manage it and sustain it better until you make more purchases.

As for sports they bring in revenue to the school. More revenue means more things to spend on, that way instead of making the government pay for free college you make the university (if there are enough funds.)

Also a lot of states have lottery tax and that money goes to scholarships, so if something else was lagalized (Marajuana is a good example) the extra income from that could be used for various scholarships.

We need more means to make money before we spend it.

3 years, 6 months ago

I don't see how college sports relates to this, but educating the public is the best way to ensure a prosperous country. it's an investment that will pay off handsomely.

it was business as usual and the cutting back on social spending and policy that destroyed our economy. continuing the same practices will not fix it.

uneducated people will only create more strain on the system and will not be able to contribute, especially with unskilled jobs leaving our markets. you are afraid of spending but what business succeeds without first making investments? cutting corners is how businesses die.

3 years, 6 months ago

When did I say give up? Right now America does not need free college education, not while we are in a recession. Once Americans can get the budget and financial issues squared away I could see it make more sense then. As for now, no. I think cheaters should be held more liable. (i.e. if a star quarterback back cheats it gets brushed under the rug, if Joe snuff from some little town in Mississippi cheats he's expelled) I think the better alternative for free college right now is holding colleges more accountable for their expendatures and revenue.

For example the NCAA is a great means to give to students. They publish sports on National TV and makes millions while the athletes don't see that much of it.

Also students have to pay for room and board but can't get basic work orders done in time, while they spend thousands in equipment for sports.

All of this relies heavily on who is charge. If we hold him/her more accountable we should see better results.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

so you suggest we give up cause it's too hard? very American.

if someone cheats, they will never get past the harder later classes.

and if they do, and cheat their way all the way through successfully, then that is a useful skill in life as well and they may likely wing their way into a successful career anyway.

regardless, our cheating graduates lead successful careers, America is losing crappy low wage jobs, but our professionals are doing very well, so college is working.

I do not agree with your defeatist attitude and I find it unamerican. it will only weaken the nation. and even if cheating will never be completely stopped, we can lower it and make it harder to get away with it. we will never completely stop crime, should we stop trying to fight crime? that's proposterous.

3 years, 6 months ago

The truth of the matter is, college isn't meant for everyone. We all want degrees, cars, houses, comfortable means, but it's not always there. Having a person pay for it is one means to start chipping into the pool of people who don't want to do the extra work. (Granted there are people who want to go and say they can't afford it, they do offer grants and financial means to assist that person. Also if that person did better in high school and on their SAT/ACT they would also have increased chances of getting a scholarship) Teachers do teach kids at young ages, that education starts now, but they're kids. I remember as a kid and I was told that I was just said, "I have next year, or next week, or tomorrow." kids will be kids though.

3 years, 6 months ago

I don't think it makes any sense to provide free college education if the average student isn't even putting in the effort to achieve a higher education. If you would have read my link you'd see that it starts on high school where it is already free education. I think college should be made tougher and not free. That way if a student wants to cheat they can get removed from the college (like most colleges do) while losing money that they invested in. If it is free then it's easier to cheat and skate by since who is to say they won't cheat again? We will never defeat cheating on exams and normal class work, but we shouldn't just walk around it and allow it easier means.

3 years, 6 months ago

also I made arguments that negate the cheating point completely.

if people cheat is the right move to forget education? or to combat the cheating while continuing to educate.

if free college is meant to give people who never went to college an opportunity, how are you blaming them for the activities of those already in college and completely unrelated to those free college is meant to help? those who do not have access to the schools are not guilty of cheating in them.

thus the cheating statistics of those already in school are irrelevant to the population this topic is referring too.

it's not my fault you totally missed my points....

3 years, 6 months ago

Lol, then you're not actually reading it and just swiping through

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

I went through the page and even opened it on my desktop. I saw no stats. unless someone else verifies it's there, I am done wasting my time.

3 years, 6 months ago

I gave you the link, it's on the home page, it proved what you thought wrong, you attack personally. Sounds to me like a Donald Trump supporter. You haven't said anything that relates to this debate once I gave you the link and instead of making a debate you prefer personal attacks while you claim no one can debate. So are you going to make a debate about this topic or continue to be upset?

3 years, 6 months ago

it's very easy to say your anything on the internet, I'm actually the king of sudan, prove me wrong. leave your personal, unverifiable background out of the debate and use independent points.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

sorry, I do not believe you. I have no way to verify, but I am under the impression that you are just a troll.

I also question your military service (due to you dishonoring the army by trying to rub your supposed service in our faces)

and I question your Judaism as you sorely lack knowledge of the religion. (jews disagree on the details, but all Jews believe in afterlife and consequences of your decisions in the world)

and I question your education since you brought up college ethics while demanding I google your points for you.

I see no way for you to prove yourself, not for me to confirm these suspicions, however your credibility is nonexistent as far as I'm concerned. as far as I'm concerned, your "phone problems" are just am excuse to not back up your points and frustrate me for fun.

3 years, 6 months ago

I do know how, and yes I can read but just because something works for one person doesn't mean it will work for another. I get an error everytime that i try. I'm clearly using my device now, so what's your point there kid?

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

can you read? the app supports copy paste, and I use it all the time. I can't help it if you don't know how to use YOUR device or the app.

3 years, 6 months ago

So now you have my device and can read what exactly it says when I try? Right?

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

copy paste works perfectly fine on here. I do it all the time.

3 years, 6 months ago

1) the statistics are on the home page, stop being lazy.

2) Copy and paste doesn't let me post on here.

3) Actually read, and stop making up some bull shit excuse for how your feelings is hurt because it's not handed to you. grow up and be an adult there kid.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

I'm getting tired of your incompetence.
I don't care about grammar and spelling in your text as long as it's understandable. but if you mistype your link, how am I supposed to find the info!!!!
your supposed to copy and paste. not hand type, there are no typos with copy paste...

and your supposed to copy paste the specific page where the info is found, not make the other person search through multiple sites.

and that site is a tool for students on how to cite properly and a tool for teachers to help catch plagarism. it doesn't have any statistics.

you failed on many levels. your either really incompetent or you are just a troll, either way I'm done, this is like arguing with a wall.

3 years, 6 months ago

I could point out every spelling and grammatical mistake you make but, I chose to use a little bit of common sense and figure it out for myself.

3 years, 6 months ago

my apologies for miss spelling it, but it's a real site. With real statistics. It can show you a multitude of useful information.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

that's not even the real site.
it's plagiarism.org
not plagarism.org.
epic fail. wow.
citing a fake site with a mispelling in its address. lame

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

so it's not on that page, but I have to click around the entire site to find it? that's not how you quote. are you trying to troll me? do you really not know how to site properly or are you just playing stupid?

3 years, 6 months ago

Actually read the entire link nemiroff, if you get a bandwidth error I suggest you just go into your devices Web browser and manually search for it on there.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

just because there are no rules against social mobility does not make it economically feasible. It happens, but only in very rare cases of exceptional people, instead of being the land of promise for any who try. (as it used to be)

and we aren't paying for harvard, but local public colleges. expensive, but a fraction of the cost of subsidizing private schools.

3 years, 6 months ago

I would like to mention something. If college was free, there would be a massive influx of people attending any colleges, and while that happens the quality would drop rapidly and so will the prices. Also, the US does not have a caste system like India, where you cannot move up the social stucture. Even in our terrible economy now, we can move from poor to rich and vice versa. If we create better jobs and better pre-college education, this college issue would be almost nonexistant.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

what was that link supposed to show?
cause it doesn't show any statistics on cheating....

3 years, 6 months ago

...... just go to the hyperlinked one below your comment.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

sorry, must have missed it.
all I remember is you whining about not wanting to do your research and that I should go Google it.

can you relink or bump that thread?

3 years, 6 months ago

Plagarism.org, you get taught that in 8th grade English when writing becomes more important in studies. They can teach you how not to cheat and give statistics on cheating. Maybe if you weren't cheating in basic English class you would remember that one at least. I have been out of English class for almost a decade and remember that.

3 years, 6 months ago

If you went to college you would see how big of an issue it is though. Go to your local college and pull their statistics. From every report I've seen online it's always +60% with some being ad high as 98% (Rutgers University website shows that one) but why give a way something if it's not going to be used for what it's intended to be used for.

3 years, 6 months ago

also nemiroff, I have never heard anything legitimate from you ever, just throw around names and hissy fits.

3 years, 6 months ago

I have cited it before in a previous debate, you didn't read it evidently. I tell you what's in it you get upset about reading it. I tell you what's in it you get upset about not citing it. You just refuse to do anything just like the lazy college students.

3 years, 6 months ago

sorry for being blunt but you need to learn to back up your claims and numbers or debating with you is pointless.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

a) link your source or its just you making up nonsense.

b) then shouldn't we cut down on cheating instead of just giving up?

c) the only people who can cheat in college are the ones who can actually go to college. we are talking about those who can't and you want to even deny them the chance to try.

d) your arguments are weak, learn to debate properly. can't wait for dalton to give me an actually serious and thought out response.

3 years, 6 months ago

Students agree that 76% of them cheat with teachers agreeing that 87% do. A number that has increased over the years. That being said I'm not going to hand out a free education to people that aren't even willing to put in the work.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

the thing is free college is the last step in fixing our education system. the people who need this free college the most are still going to be screwed. They are horribly unprepared for college and before you blame the people for laziness or stupidity, run a comparison in the quality of public schools in different social class neighborhoods (and I am completely ignoring private schools which have every right to be better, only compare public schools)

we need universal preK, and equal public school education before there is any meaning in making college free. and let's not pretend hinting at any form of social investment will not create an outrage among your leadership, which I am convinced is not representing the Republican people nor their values unless it helps their agenda of transforming our nation into a feudalistic oligarchy.

3 years, 6 months ago
dalton7532
replied to...

-Free college education is the one with potentially the least problems with it. Therefore, I have little problem with it because it has some pretty good upsides.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

I'm not sure I understood you; is education the only one you have a little problem with? or is education the one you have the least problems with?

3 years, 6 months ago

-Neimroff, out of all the socialized things healthcare, education, and ect. Education is the one with the little problem I have.

3 years, 6 months ago

this is how the nation gets its money back.

those who go to school on tax payers backs will be mandated to work in the states for at least 15 years contributing to our economy, (no running off after graduation or we will treat them as tax evaders) and maybe an extra tax on their paychecks for 15 years to collect some money back directly.

that shoot make everything fair and functional.

if you pay personally then no tax, no restrictions.

3 years, 6 months ago
Nemiroff
replied to...

so public school teachers work for free?

3 years, 6 months ago

I agree that schooling should be a right only because a country should want its young to grow up and be able to take over all of the jobs and leadership roles. But there is one problem: who will pay the professors? They deserve to be payed after doing work to support their society. If school is completely free, the professors will not be payed for their work.

Then again, it is still in the government's best interest to preserve itself. I suppose it could be possible for the government to put aside a budget strictly for paying teachers natiowide but that would be a f***ton of money. Perhaps they could have a larger budget than they do now so that college students didn't have to pay so much f***ing money to absorb information?

3 years, 6 months ago

free primary school took a big investment, as did free high school. I'm sure we are stronger as a nation because our citizens are literate and have a grasp of basic knowledge.

right now our crap jobs are being outsourced. are we really gonna try to play who is willing to pay their citizens the least to win them back? or will we let them have those garbage jobs and start stealing every job worth a damn from them as we become the first nation with a fully college educated citizenry.

3 years, 6 months ago

education is a right for all, not just for those who can afford it. Schools should never be run like businesses, and the idea that if they were, they would be better is ridiculous.

3 years, 6 months ago

I honestly would not mind if college was tuition free. Poor people have no real access to college education. Tuition free college can help in some cases. However, I heard many success stories of poor people working hard and getting the needed money for the education they want. I think "free" college can really help in some cases. However, one thing I will admit is the education and the quality of the college will go down, and that goes with anything socialized. The most prominant example is healthcare. While, it helped very few, it harmed many more. Also, this is something else I want to mention. Free college is not necessarily free. Taxes will be raised. I do not know by how much, but they will be raised. I do not think fixing college can only be a socialized one, it can be a free-market one. I do think it is a very possible one.

3 years, 6 months ago
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