The debate "If humans are 75000 years old why is it that they only started doing things 6000 years ago" was started by
February 27, 2017, 11:04 pm.
By the way, Ematio is disagreeing with this statement.
9 people are on the agree side of this discussion, while 3 people are on the disagree side.
People are starting to choose their side.
It looks like most of the people in this community are on the agreeing side of this statement.
Ematio posted 6 arguments, UnderdogMike posted 3 arguments to the agreers part.
TheExistentialist posted 4 arguments to the disagreers part.
Blu_Ray, UnderdogMike, Yanksxx21, human and 5 visitors agree.
Ematio, TheExistentialist and 1 visitor disagree.
haha, yeah, I don't think that's going to happen. It's not like he even has evidence against evolution. He only has arguments from ignorance and incredulity.
I'm actually quite curious if ematio would be as open to an equally skeptical look at his views of where we came from.
yeah, I unfortunately looked at a source that dated some of the construction material from the tunnels under the pyramids rather than the pyramids themselves. I used a Croatian study which apparently translated poorly in the web translator. The "pyramids" themselves are actually part of the flatiron formation, it was the tunnels under it that had some materials dating back to 25k years ago. So my apologies for misquoting the study.
However, the critique of the agricultural theory @Ematio made stands due to the Gobekli Tepe being at least as old as the advent of agriculture and only slightly younger than the end of the ice age and having been produced at a time where the human population was believed to be too scarce for civilizations to have existed.
The rebuttal here is very simple though. Gobekli Tepe does not represent the advent of civilization, it represents the advent of worship and religious sites. We still don't see large civilizations and permanent civil structures until the human population explosion post agriculture.
I'd like to know what @ematio's point is with all this? It's not like outliers and new time lines change much in terms of our understanding of human evolution, it simply changes our perception of their ability to solve problems. We used to think that tools came about around 2.4-2.3 mya around the time of Homo habilis. However, we now found tools dating back 3.36 mya ago. This would be during the time of Australopithecus afarensis or Kenyanthropus platyops, so even before the genus Homo. It simply makes us re-evaluate the sophistication of our ancestors' intellect however, I fail to see how any of this is relevant to human evolution.
Yeah, I'm the same there, but I'm just building off claims
I'm not familiar with the Bosnian pyramids. a quick search claims at least part of their proposed history is a fraud. I'll look into it later if existentialist doesn't clarify.
And how did they have agriculture during the ice age you guys say prevented them from settling to the point where they could create the world's largest pyramids?
This is given that the bosnian pyramids are actuslly 25,000 years old like you say
Alright, so if humanity had to wait until the ice age ended, and if the bosnian temples are actually that old, how is it that the nomads constructed this giant pyramid during the ice age, which only ended about 12,000 years ago? The theories contradict
btw, we marvel at the pyramids for standing for nearly 10,000 years. why do you assume so casually that 2 million year old structures would even still be standing?
without maintenance, our great cities will dissappear within only a few centuries.
the ice age started 1.8m years ago.
humans as we are today have been around 200,000 years ago.
there is no way humans as we know today existed before the ice age.
if your going to attack a position try to get that position right first.
oh boy.....let's school you a little bit here because it's obvious whoever home schooled you did a pretty piss poor job when it comes to history and science.
Your claim that "the oldest man made structures on the planet are all less than 4,000 years old" is simply false. You are way too ignorant of the facts for your criticisms to have any real weight. The Yonaguni Monument is about 8,000 yrs old, Gobekli Tepe in Turkey is about 11,500 yrs old, and the Bosnian Pyramid is about 25,000 yrs old.
you can't even get the basic facts for your arguments right.....you should really go read up on the subjects you're about to discuss. As it sits right now, the only conclusion anyone can really draw is that your ignorance on this subject is astounding.
Now, let's talk about the meat of your "argument" (I can hardly believe I would even call it that).
200k years ago, humans were nomadic and on the brink of extinction. In fact, our population didn't crest a million until the advent of agriculture 12,000 yrs ago. Now, it makes perfect sense that permanent structures were rare until then as you were simply going to move on to hunt and gather before the advent of agriculture. You are missing the fact that well before we had structures, humans created tools, art, clothing, etc.... In fact, we found tools made by members of the genus Homo long before there were homo-sapiens. So, we created things, solved problems etc... I'd hardly call that the behavior of "morons".
mankind supposedly existed as we are today long before the ice age. so where are the pre-ice age cities or structures?
don't feel bad, Christopher Hitchens couldn't even answer this question, and he was the smartest athiest apologist around. ;)
and they also had to wait for the ice age to end before anything like agriculture can develope. they don't control that time. and you can't have cities without agriculutre.
yes... you try walking across the globe, and then do it while trying to actually sustain a tribe rather then with a backpack stocked with food and convenience stores along the way. with predators everywhere.
and... that took 196,000 years?
and you say I'm the one underestimating mankind? lol
well before setting down roots with civilizations early man was busy DOMINATING EVERY OTHER LIVING THING. check the overkill hypothesis, we were doing pretty well for ourselves. this is when we spread all around the world.
the reason we started creating civilizations was because the ice age came to an end and we were able to sustain agriculture which lead to cities instead of more wander gathering.
early man developed fire, and cooking, which was essential for brain development because we pretty much "predigested" the tougher proteins while cooking leaving a ton of extra energy for brain development.
your underestimating humanity.
only ones less than 4000 years old.
How many of those rocks are still stacked today?
I learned to stack rocks when I was one year old :)
you just made your case worse by a minimum factor of 3. lol
grant that civilization began 6 thousand years ago, yet mankind has been here for a minimum of 200k years? what kind of morons were they? the oldest man made structures on the planet are all less than 4,000 years old. you want to tell me that for 196,000 years of mankind being essentially unchanged, they couldn't manage to STACK FREAKING ROCKS?
That's a strange question.... The most obvious answer to it is because "inventing" things helped us solve problems (I.e. we invented tools). First we used rocks to crack shells, made Flint knives, etc... Slowly tools became more complex to solve more and more complex problems.
Some apes and monkeys are doing the same thing now.
Why did people start to invent things btw?
Oh boy.....So @ematio obviously didn't do any research before posting this topic.
Let's see if we can't sort this out though. The first homo-sapiens evolved about 200,000 years ago, not 75,000. I don't know where you got the 75,000.... The first human ancestor (genus homo) evolved about 2.5 mya.
The first cave paintings are about 30,000 yrs old. The first signs of agriculture date back to about 12,000 yrs ago. The first civilizations are date back to about 5,000 BCE. This makes civilizations about 6-7k years old. Perhaps this is what @ematio is talking about....But by his wording and wrong dates, I'd say he/she is just uninformed about the subject.
Because it took tribes to travel across the world to tell about their inventions to the other tribes. It was then when all tribes came to know about it and started to make their things.
For example if you were to invent a wheel back then, and you would travel around the world to other tribes that you have invented a wheel. And it took a lot of time to travel. Since now, the other tribe came toknow about the wheel, they made a cart and they could show up their invention to other tribes faster. Thats the reason.
it may take 10 years by foot, but it took 10 months with carts, 10 days in a steam ship, 10 hours in a flight, and now takes 10 milliseconds over the internet.