The debate "If you disagree with a group of people they will call you hateful that is actually not good" was started by
September 20, 2016, 5:53 pm.
15 people are on the agree side of this discussion, while 7 people are on the disagree side.
People are starting to choose their side.
It looks like most of the people in this community are on the agreeing side of this statement.
fadi posted 2 arguments, neveralone posted 5 arguments, TheExistentialist posted 1 argument to the agreers part.
Nemiroff posted 4 arguments to the disagreers part.
fadi, north, neveralone, TheExistentialist, Hijumi, makson and 9 visitors agree.
Nemiroff, thereal and 5 visitors disagree.
Christ would have stoned the adulterer had that been the original intention. However, tradition and the times of the events point to the fact that was not intended. The old laws still stand, but the entirety of the new testament is how to act upon those laws. Juxtaposing the old and new is superficial if you do not contextualize the purpose the new. Literal readings are not justification if they are not in proper spirits with the writings.
How was it quoted out of context? It's pretty clear "For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished...." heaven and earth haven't disappeared, therefore the old laws still stand.
You can argue the semantics of it all you like, but the larger point still stands: if someone acts in a way which is justified by doctrine and they claim said doctrine, then they are representative of that doctrine. Im not saying they speak for the group as a whole, not are they representing the group as a whole. They are representing the worst parts of that doctrine however. I'll grant you that Christians have come a long way in sterilizing a lot of their doctrine through various methods and thus its not as likely that you'll see a Christian act on the most extreme interpretations of their texts.
The portion on Christianity is entirely false. The immorality of adultery is identical to the old testament; however, the new testament provides a fulfilment of the old. In the new, new traditions are employed in order to worship god in the same moral code as before, but in traditions mayching the actions of Christ. I will also add a logical fallacy to misquoting a passage out of the context or scope of its original purpose.
Anyone who acts in accordance to their chosen dogma should be identified by that dogma. I'll provide some examples to illustrate my point.
If a someone practices forced FGM in the name of Islam, then he's not a Muslim. FGM is a tribal tradition and the Koran explicitly allows it, but states it is voluntary. So forced FGM cannot be rectified with the Koran.
If a someone throws a homosexual person off a roof, claims it was inspired by the Koran, then he is a Muslim. It is an act that is absolutely rectifiable through their faith and doctrine.
Essentially, a Muslim is any person who performs acts which Mohamed either explicitly advocates, performed, or for which there is a theological basis that is undeniable.
If a someone commits a suicide bombing with the idea of martyrdom, he is not a christian. The concept of violent martyrdom cannot be rectified with their doctrine.
If a someone however, stones his adulterous wife in accordance with his doctrine he is a Christian. It's easy to rectify their actions through their faith.
Essentially, a Christian is any person who performs acts which Jesus either explicitly advocates, performed, or for which there is a theological basis that is undeniable....(this includes the old testament since Jesus stated: "For truly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass the law until all is accomplished. Whoever then relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but he who does them and teaches them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven." Matthew 5:18-19
that is true. it really depends on ur definition of true Christians for me it's what I said for others what u said but that can be said for anything so pointless really in the end.
the argument could be made just as easily that the true Christians are the ones who follow the word of the Catholic Church and therefore the Pope, since catholics make up the majority of Christians. and the Pope told them to kill the Muslims and conquer the holy Land because God wills it.
everyone makes mistakes. that's part of being human. u can't tell me u never were told a lie and believed it. and what I think biggin means by true Christians is people who believe the Bible and act on what God says in it instead of saying they believe and do nothing.
so the Pope didn't call for the crusades? go ahead and check, I'll wait.
Pope urban II called on all Christians to attack the Muslims because God wills it. he did this to increase the power and authority of the church over the people of Europe.
in 1095 the Pope did have jurisdiction over all of Europe and the majority of Christians. when the Pope called for Christendom to make war, Christendom made war. and countless people were murdered as a result. the blood of millions is on the hands of the Christian religion.
The intellectually dishonesty only gets worse for you history"buff" If you were so smart, you would know the pope does not have jurisdiction over all Christains and over the tennets of Christainity.
I don't think you get to decide who the true Christians are. when the Pope called for Christians to murder Muslims in the crusades, that was the voice of Christianity calling for mass murder. Christianity is not the peaceful, innocent religion you seem to think it is.
Well not all of us. The real Christians don't sit and wait to hate on somebody whether its their sexuality, their beliefs, or the way they act. If you have ever met a true Christian you would realize the difference. But next time please don't say something like that, that makes us a group, it's kinda annoying. True Christians don't believe that hate is something good to do to someone they don't like. But there are extremists out there so be careful bro.
I agree which is why when I saw what people were taking my earlier message as I explained. and I also agree on a lot of Christians being judgmental but I will disagree on the amount. through my life I have seen more people down on Christians simply because they do not believe. but I could be wrong this is my exp. and I am bias being Christian but everyone is bias on the subject because this really is a matter of what u believe.
especially since I'm not actually an atheist. you're lumping in a group I'm not actually in. and I don't think anything I've said on here would constitute hate.
Christians and Christianity in general has, and continues to, do alot of terrible things. it doesn't make me hateful to point them out.
@nermiroff I apologize I should have wrote that better. I did not mean all atheist. I meant the ones who are extremist that go out of there way to insult other religions. we all have them and I should not of said it like that.
@historybuff on the eternal part I don't understand why u think the records are important so please explain. and on the diff. sec. of Christianity and I could be wrong but we as being are not perfect so how could we tell if something is perfect? i may see my religion as perfect but others like u may see theirs as perfect and we spend all this time agreeing and going around in circles because what this will eventually end up as who's religion being atheist or Christian is right and who's is wrong and the only real way to prove that is to die. so I guess what I am saying is we can either debate on this till we die or agree to disagree.
OK biggns. the only person here hating on Christianity is buff... so please stop attributing that to atheists in general. we are not a group with a predetermined mantra or anything like that. I hate on the way many modern day, often American Christians try to impose their religious views on others but I have routinely praised the message jesus was told to have spread.
if your gonna talk about buff, talk about buff. but don't generalize in ignorance.
Wow at all the hate on Christianity. But i see where most of you atheists are coming from, gay people are just people they shouldnt be shunned from society, yes its a sin but wheres the love? Jesus said love thy neighbour, he didnt say love only christians and shun the rest of the world out! This is why so many atheists are hating on Christianity because of extremists like you! Wait a minute History buff, your comment said that our Bible is outdated and our religion is going to die? Why would it die out, is it because its old so in the future Darwins theory of evolution is gonna die out to? Historybuff your a moron!
I'd your religion were eternal then we wouldn't have excellent historical records before it's existence.
if your religion were perfect there wouldn't be numerous different Christian sect that all believe your sect is heresy.
so you are just categorically wrong.
you make a lot of assumptions.
why would I be angry at something I don't believe exists.
our religion which u make sound like something found in the sewers is eternal and perfect. it will outlast u and all u atheist who are just angry with yourselves and God.
you think it is immoral. the majority of the civilized world disagrees with you. including the majority of Americans. your religion based morality is outdated. if it doesn't catch up to the modern world it is going to die out.
do you like your children seeing a man having sex with a man in the street or kissing a man that is immoral
*in your other identical repetitive thread.
you just equating being gay with "we should legalize sexual harassment. you are a horrible person.
i was not harassing or demonizing anyone i was saying gays are proud sinners so they can not be christians
if you are hateful to a group of people you are hateful whether or not someone agrees with you.
if you deny global warming I will disagree with you but I won't consider you hateful. however if you demonize and needlessly harrass a group of people, you are hateful.