The debate "The God isn't real" was started by
April 16, 2017, 10:31 am.
94 people are on the agree side of this discussion, while 167 people are on the disagree side.
That might be enough to see the common perception.
It looks like most people are against to this statement.
makson posted 1038 arguments, human posted 6 arguments, neveralone posted 39 arguments, M3phisto posted 3 arguments, Nemiroff posted 2 arguments to the agreers part.
neveralone posted 686 arguments, Ematio posted 44 arguments, makson posted 10 arguments, Nemiroff posted 13 arguments, Mrjudge posted 1 argument, Rahul posted 2 arguments, Christian posted 1 argument to the disagreers part.
szkzsz44, human, duffers, Tshiamo, Mr_Beuller, Mrjudge, benjaminmartn, Avi, jivanl, Pinkman, zainab, M3phisto, makson, neveralone and 80 visitors agree.
Cjselfie01, thereal, Veenie, siddusurv, quadreon1, Ematio, zediraw, Rahul, TimRSA, kkay3002, C, lilgamer84, Shally_Pally, The13yearoldconservative, Christian, takolijon, Kskbharathi, Etabob and 149 visitors disagree.
I can't find the source right now, it means 3 days pause
btw I won't be on here tomorrow or the day after.
it's illogical because if he's everywhere, his voice is everywhere
depends on how he wishes to he heard.
There's no much similarities? I am bored to give you all the similarities, but I'll do it tomorrow. When God speaks, everyone can hear him because he's omnipresent, right?
he isn't in that one spot more than everywhere else. he just gives u something to look at to help. if a voice just comes booming everywhere around u would u not be freaked out? its pretty much a courtesy to u.
if u mean the egyptian god Horus then no there isn't much similarities.
It's illogical to be everywhere and in one place more then that something can come from nothing.
PS: How do you explain the similarities with Horus and Jesus? It's too much to be a coincidence
this is again the physical manifestation of God.
If God sits on a throne above the circle of earth, he's not omnipresent because he's only at one place - throne.
if the"corners" is mistranslation, that's it's true meaning?
it says so right after that. that the angels release the four winds.
ah we are back on this!
great I've been meaning to ask.
you say sphere does not have corners, therefore 4 it means earth is flat.
I quoted "he sits on a throne above the circle of the earth"
And you said "it's a flat circle" (I don't know how, maybe random guess? lol)
But even if it is flat circle, a circle of any kind still has no corners...
so the "corners" must be a mistranslation or their word for something else, like the cardinal directions.
And cannot possible mean anything regarding flatness.
But how do you know it's talking about the winds?
back then that is an often phrase. I believe mostly used by sailors. but not for sure on that. they would say as such since the wind could come from the north east south or west. ergo the four corners.
the wind has corners?
it's talking about the wind. seeing the future events that happen in Revelations. this is a guy during Jesus's time. he isn't going to be able to explain it very well don't u think? he isn't God.
4 corners at the earth doesn't mean it's flat?
again the Bible does not.
I don't, but the Bible says it is.
do u believe the earth is flat?
okay, is the earth flat?
no it's not just like it's not for the flat Earth. if u ever want this debate to move forward u will need to leave past arguement behind
it isn't said directly, but it's said like for the flat earth
those are guesses on how long. it isn't the official time.
5 days + before Abraham (2000 years) and Abraham has lived before 4000 years (2000 yrs BC) so
5 days + ~2000 yrs + ~4000yrs = 6000yrs
the Bible itself doesn't say how old the earth is. people reading the Bible do.
Bible says God made humans 6-10k years ago and evolution says totally different things
proven God? never. nor do I think it ever will because God isn't something to be proven. now when has something science has shown that seems to go with the Bible. all the time.
when is the last time the science has proven God?
u r under the idea they go agaisnt each other and can't exist. they don't.
Other Christian said a different story, it's always like that.... Why do you believe that story of you can choose science what is not contradictable or impossible?
u r thinking biologically. God creates us. he chooses wether we live or not. do u think God would let them get pregnant when he's about to do the flood? no.
Do you really claim that in entire world there was no baby? If they were sinning so much, they would cheat their wives, right? That means baby comes because there was no condoms...
unborn babies cant do anything much besides grow so they are definitely without sin.
with Benjamin Franklin.
And unborn babies?
I had a personal experience with him
it says he was man and son of God. for the flood thing that can be infered by it saying that there was nothing without sin. babies can't sin. ergo if there is no one without sin and babies can't sin the. there couldn't of been any.
it's amazing that u were there to hear him talk. most of us don't have such a chance.
But the Bible doesn't say Jesus wasn't half duck like it doesn't say there were no children in the flood
his voice was men's voice and in combination with his face, the chances he was a man are pretty big to become a fact
the point is that though it's obviously ridiculous it cant be disproven. except the women thing. just dig up his bones and do a dna sample to prove it's him and that it's male.
some women have guys faces.
his face was anatomically? men's face
people could of changed the paintings.
he didn't look like a woman
a link would still be interesting.
why can't u disprove that Benjamin Franklin is a women?
I'm talking about the big bang
If it's illogical, why can't you disprove it?
well in God intervening all the time I would say look what happened when he did. they would thank him for a little time and then go back to sinning usually doing more. society could also maybe be seen as a baby to God back then and needed strong guidance but now we are matured to child age and can look after ourselves a bit more. on healings and the such they still happen. not as often as in the Bible but they still do.
Then why did God speak to so many people in the past? What happened that God became shy? People used to perform miracles in God's name, but now not even the Pope will heal dying children. What changed?
I already believe as such but I would be interested if u provided a link
exactly. it's illogical to believe Benjamin was a women or had a skunks tail just like it's ridiculous to think Jesus had a duck head
With the research, you will understand how something can come from nothing and something eternal.
same as duck headed Jesus and skunks tail
God doesn't want to be proven. he wants to be trusted.
just answer me can you prove the existence of God? what I didn't answer?
ur going circular again. btw u didn't answer the debate.
Can you prove God exists?
where r u going with research? btw since u can't prove they didn't have a skunks tail or was actually a women then by ur logic they are women and they do have a skunks tail
Research about quantum fields
I can't prove they don't. You don't understand quantum fields, research about them bit
btw plenty of great thinkers and inventors and scientist at least admit that the idea could be true so it isn't illogical.
it's illogical to think something can't come from nothing?ps. prove Alexander doesn't have a sounds tail or Benjamin wasn't a women.
there's no evidence of god's existence and it's illogical to think he exists. PS: You still haven't disproved Jesus with a duck - head
there is no evidence as such. and it's simply illogical to think he did.
can you prove he didn't have a duck head?
exactly it doesn't say he had a duck head anywhere. it's ridiculous. also if someone had a duck head do u not think that's worth mentioning? ps do u seriously think he had a duck head?
must of linked u with someone else
How do you know that if the Bible doesn't say he wasn't?
I never said God can't
he was all man. there was no duck head. idk where u got that odd idea.
so u can give that trait to it but God can't possibly always have been here?
A man with a head of a duck
It had no beginning, it was happening always
I have a strange belief since the records show a man. not an weird Egyptian god
and what began that
Yes, he's omnipotent. Or in other case, only his head was a head of a duck. Everything was same, except his head.
the black hole wasn't supposed to start big bang, I mean it starts a contraction and the big bang is contracting always. The things got into existence because of quantum fields
u think that a human birthed a duck that could speak heal people (specifically said with hands so duck already out) cast out demons, walk on water, make food for thousands from bread and fish, take up all sin, get tortured and put on trial, nailed to a cross, stabbed in the side, rose from the dead after 3 days, and was also a man?
and where did the star come from if the black hole was supposed to start the big bang
It didn't. It came from like death of a star. PS: Jesus was a duck because there's no place in the Bible that says he wasn't.
so how did a black hole come from nothing
Black holes are being bigger and bigger,,......
do how can a black hole do that. and I would say he only has forever existed.
I don't think I've said that, but God can't do both unless he stop existing and then start existing, then stop and start....... If God always existed, he couldn't have come from nothing. If God came from nothing, he couldn't have always existed
u have said God can't exist forever and that he can't just come from nothing. yet u give these attributes to a black hole.
these are things u have gone against when on the other side. u do realize that right?
1) Came from? nothing
2) Always existed
The big bang is both
just out of curiosity where exactly does it go and are u sure it's the same one. then simply replace black hole with universe on my last debate.
The black hole doesn't exist always. universe does
and yet u rely on a black hole that has always existed and always will. does that not sound familiar but with less living qualities?
Yes. I don't need faith for black holes
this is the same arguement that u put on about if both were forgotten science would be the only thing remembered and again it relies completely on if the faith is wrong.
The same results come from the same tests. People would conclude it in 1000 years if we forget it now
and before that and before that ect. u seem to put a lot of faith in a black hole forever existing.
it will lose energy, stop expanding, the black hole will turn it to nothing and here we go again!
It didn't exist because the black hole before turned previous contraction into nothing.
or simply Revelations. take ur pick.
and from what I'm reading here it sounds like it didn't exist at one point. though if I remember correctly they beleive the universe was actually quite small and inflated to the size we see today and is continuing to expand.
And it's contracting! For few billion years the giant black hole will turn everything to nothing and everything will start again (another contraction-another big bang)
The big bang says the universe always existed and it's contracting. You obviously didn't know this, please educate yourself at this topic
idk haven't really looked into it much. there's obviously the big bang.
Could you tell me other theories?
that is one of many theories.
Science is contradictable with God.
Science says universe always existed in one form or another.
Religion says God always existed.
I accept science for what it is. seeking truth. I enjoy it quite a bit. there is no compromise on my faith or how I look at science
Why don't you accept the science like it is, without supernatural and without mixes?
I do both. there not agaisnt each other. I accept my ignorance in many areas and look to science and religion for answers. if u look at their differences that will be all u see but there are similarities as well.
So, there's many things you don't know our believe in supernatural. Why don't you choose science?
who knows. though forgetting is probably not something he does and not being able to is certainly not a weakness
Is he able now, since he's all powerful?
he was able to forget.
You say he can know everything and forget in same time
forget? he was human...
How can Jesus do that if he knows everything too?
that's more on Jesus. though it might converge with God as well
So, God is able to learn, forget, remember or something like that? He can learn before and after knowing everything?
theoretically. though the only one stated to know everything is God.
they all know everything?
God is directly spoken on this though they all probably are
so who of them knows everything?
I read it. the best way I know is think of a map. the beginning and end is God. the actual path is Jesus and a guide would be the holy Spirit. they all are part of the map but each with there own jobs.
Explain it like how someone has explained it to you?
do u know an easy way to explain the trinity?
you're answering by "It's hard to explain"
no I am answering a challenge
You're setting the things up for you
it's not an excuse if it's true.
that's just an excuse?
it's a complex trinity. they are separate but also one. it gets very complex and I'm probably not the best at explaining it.
Jesus isn't the God, he's another person.
Jesus did a lot of the learning and I wouldn't say knowing everything makes u flawed.
Learning is an example.
what do u mean by impossible?
You say God can do everything but he can't do some things that are impossible? Then he canNOT do everything.
u understand how it works. but to truly feel how it works is where Jesus comes in.
I see it's working, but I can't feel it working.
that is an debate inside the church
how can u know how a computer program works when ur not a computer?
He can make a mistake? He already did. (Noah's flood because he repented after that)
How can he know something if he has never done that?
being able to do something and doing it are two different things. u have the ability to kill why aren't u on a killing rampage?
he made us, our brain, and all our feelings. yes he knows what it feels like
Does God know how it feels when you do a mistake?
By having unlimited power, you can do everything, right? Everything includes mistakes.
that would be omniscience and no it does not include mistakes or ignorance. in fact omniscience requires the complete absence of ignorance.
actually omnipotence just means unlimited or great power. it doesn't say anything about mistakes or things as such.
omnipotence includes making mistakes...
How about this:
it doesn't say, to my knowledge, that he can do anything anywhere in the bible. it says he's all powerful, and all knowing.
so yes, there are things he can't do, like mistakes, ignorance and weakness.
Good job, you just argued for gods greatness cause you proved he can't be anything but perfection :D
If you say "he can't" that means he's not omnipotent. He's beyond our understanding and he could do that, but he can't.
he can't do mistakes, he can't have a moment of weakness, he can't display ignorance.
Yes, he can't display flaws. that isn't a flaw.
"He can't do them" is contradictable with "he can do everything"
he can't not do them because they are against his nature, he can't do them because they are already done.
It's like saying Steven hawking can't learn basic physics (because he has long mastered them) therefore he must be an idiot.
And not being able to grow because you are everything is not a limitation!
Not being able to learn because you know everything is not a flaw!
Not being able to create something you can't lift because there is nothing you Can't lift is not a weakness!
But if it's logically impossible it means it's against his nature. If he can't do things that are against his nature, he's not omnipotent. Here would addressing my previous argument come.
nothing about what he said suggests everyone is omnipotent.
The issue is omnipresence, not omnipotence.
Not being able to grow because you are everything is not an excuse. growing would be a logical impossibility in that situation.
And not being able to grow because you are everything is not a limitation!
Not being able to learn because you know everything is not a flaw!
Not being able to create something you can't lift because there is nothing you Can't lift is not a weakness!
Why is it that every time I open this thread I see the same failing argument!
Are you najam or something? (I know your not, just driving the point home, hopefully)
that's just an excuse. by your logic, everyone is omnipotent. "If you occupy all space, is there anywhere to grow?" is an excuse. It means "it's against his nature", but whatever you ask me 'can I do something?', I can just provide an excuse or "it's against my own nature"
if u occupy all space is there anywhere to grow? depends what u define as grow. technically he could go in human form and then grow in size but he occupies all space so...haha
He didn't really grow? Is he able to really grow?
the arguement right below urs answers that.
if he's omnipotent he could grow without a phisycal manifestation? how?
well I was going to say when he comes in human form but he is still omnipresent then so he didn't really grow but how can an omnipresent being even grow when it occupies all space?
How can an omnipresent being grow?
they did not mean mentally, they meant physically. god isn't even physical.
neveralone assumed as such from a more philosophical standpoint and replied with a question rather than an answer of certainty.
my response also had the qualifier of "life as we define it" because the definition of life can change. we've only ever experienced one kind of life, our own. making final assumptions on such a small pool of examples is stupid.
You too should add alittle uncertainty to your uncertain statements, because your argument becomes weak if you are repeatedly wrong. I agree with your conclusion, god is most likely not alive, but your definition of life was dead wrong.
click the reply button
so you can't prove existence of something alive, everywhere, doing good things?
going on 2k, I can see that lol
I replied to it.
And neveralone? said he is
i said that out of annoyance and will delete. I don't truly think so.
well he could technically grow. now reproducing is a bit harder. Jesus is a direct son but wasn't made through sex or other such reproducing methods but is still technically God's direct son.
god is not alive by our definition because he does not grow and does not reproduce.
evolution is the only sensible explanation that fits all the evidence we find.
not a few cherry picked scenarios while ignoring alternative explanations and ignoring conflicting evidence. ALL OF IT.
there is no viable alternative to evolution.
And no intelligent design is not an alternative. It's many flaws and assumptions aside, all it says is that there must be a designer. it says nothing about the design which may as well include evolution. likewise evolution only describes the process, not the source of the process.
so intelligent design literally says nothing.
no it doesn't
definition of alive includes consuming food and breathing
why wouldn't he be?
is God alive?
that doesn't show brains it shows stupidity and lack of curiosity. science explores the unknown and asks the infinite question of why. it gladly tries to find out strange and new things. not do surveys and learn nothing.
1) Human fossils are graduated an more complex then for an example Lucy.
2) 1% of people in Africa have evolved to be immune to AIDS, so HIV can't make it.
3) DNA comparation.
4) Comparative anatomy.
5) Molecular biology.
Because people are getting smarter
Makson, can you prove evolution created us?
trying... and they never will
how many scientist and researchers are trying to prove it? any that have tried become laughing stocks and anything they info they find gets tossed.
I know they've used reason.... Your life is based at believing in an unproven book?
they also had logic and reason and used both as well. else they couldn't use that system. either ur wanting religion to seem to only be used by illogical people or being intellectually dishonest. u remember how I said unless ur open to the idea this will get nowhere?
And they used it like this:
that system has been used in that time and probably before then. it's one of the oldest systems.
Aristotle didn't know how it works, he was just amazed. It has to do something with it because they have used the system of elimination.
that has nothing to do with it. also Aristotle is another example why saying the age doesn't matter isn't true.
But those people didn't know about the evolution (except Aristotle but noone took it as real)
that doesn't change anything?. there was still plenty of logic and wisdom. to say that means nothing of that time has any worth when it obviously does.
In this case it does because people didn't know almost anything about science
age doesn't make it a lie. or else the idea of gravity is a lie.
So your life is based at faith that 2000 years old book is real? Seriously?
not really. to actually prove the Bible u would have to have Jesus to come down and say it. which all things considering u wouldn't want. that is the start of Revelations
yes, but it's same
u did read the part where I said it didn't prove it right?
I didn't only looking up to Google translate and we've passed through that, I said "nevermind"...
If I write a book with real places and events and include an unicorn, would that unicorn be real?
Makson, are you really looking for answers, or are you looking for reasons not to believe the Bible?
When I pointed out that a word from hebrew one time was mistranslated, you kept telling me that I was wrong because you put the word into google translate. I looked at the real and possible meanings of the word.
it shows real places and events. that may not fully show it but it certainly helps.
you still haven't proved it is
so? saying penguins will fly isn't technically a lie. they do so now. on planes.haha
seriously though ur going back to the argument of if the Bible is trustworthy or not.
I could claim whatever I want without time limit and it can't be disproven.
there is a time. God's got it set and has said the signs for when it will happen. but a time limit isn't needed for something to make sense
It doesn't make sense because a prophecy without a time limit can't be wrong. (there's always a next day so...)
My prophecy: At 4010th year, penguins will start to fly.
as a side note it is said only God knows when it will happen
if ur seeing everything happening in Revelations are u going to ask what time it's in?
if prophecies don't come with a fulfill by date, they are pathetic and invalid. And definitely not worthy of prophets of a perfect god. they are scams perpetuated by frauds.
it's their phrophcies so I don't think their going to get it wrong unless it doesn't come true. as a side note if u have been under the mindset of the Bible being wrong this whole time then it's no wonder we have been going on this long. if u don't change that then we won't be able to move forward.
then they were wrong as BIBLE is
I think psychdave or nemiroff gave a percentage for the KJV which was 90 something percent accurate. most of the time it's how u interpret it. their are a ton of metaphors and similes in the Bible.
well back then people described it looking like a square when they look out and a lot of people who just look would say the same. especially if their are four angels making the "corners" I would bet.
well I don't think they know about spheres or to call them that back then. it would more than likely still be called a circle back then. it didn't sound like a mistranslation. I think my answer easily answers it.
the whole Bible is mistranslated
no, it looks like I'm on a circle plate.
nice point, however, how do you explain Isaiah 40 22?
"he sits enthroned above the CIRCLE of the earth"?
as for the corners line, at first i believed it was a reference to the 4 cardinal directions, but according to
It's a mistranslation with the Greek work of quadrants which was a reference to maps.
@neveralone this is what others and I have tries to say when we said mistranslations can drastically change meanings.
when u look around there seems to be four sides doesn't it? this is from John. he was a man describing what he saw. if u saw four angels far out each in different? directions then u would probably describe it the same would u not?
does 4 corners exist at sphere?
Also, 4 corners argument doesnt prove anything
1. The Bible isn't meant to be science book
2. That doesn't mean there can't be any science in it
3. God made stuff in such a way that it could be discovered.
4. Modern society had to catch up to the Bible's standards of medicine
5. Somehow a guy discovered that there are 10 dimesions in the Bible. Science has discovered that there are in fact 10 dimensions
John. it is told by John. he had this as a prophesy.
You cretins haven't got rid of this blasphemous post yet?
Only ingrates reject faith!
As far as God can see?
it is as far as he can see.
I did some quick research. apparently we discovered that the earth was round in bc while Revelations was written in ad.
"angels at four corners", that means earth is square
u misunderstood it. if u read on it talks about holding the 4 winds of the earth. north,east, south,west. this is as far as he can see not a literal corner.
if the Bible interprets anything close it would be that the earth isn't hold up by an animal. it says he created the heaven and the earth.
Bible says the world is flat
I meant something else...
I've never seen the word hydrogen in the bible.
science is a tool. it only tells what it's pointed to. at the same time God gave an answer to people about this science of that time was saying the world was flat.
u must of misunderstood. if u are a baby should I start telling u the big bang theory and all details in exactly how I made it? no u wouldn't comprehend. God made it simple because we weren't ready for stuff as advanced for that time as atoms which we don't even fully understand today.
Well, sciences does and a perfect being doesn't hmmm
According to the big bang:
1. Universe and darkness (always existed)
According to the Bible:
1. God and darkness (always existed)
the Bible Says he said let there be light. if u were about as smart as a cave man do u think God is going to go into details like atoms?
hydrogen was the first atom. before hydrogen can exist, electrons have to first exist, and other subatomic particles.
And light wasn't the first thing to exist in the bible. first it was darkness. And you can have all the hydrogen in the world, its still darkness :P
Not really, but I'm talking about substances and the first matter was hydrogen. If hydrogen was first matter then light couldn't be the first thing that existed according to the Bible.
I know. Still doesn't change literally anything.
but God is not.
light is matter.
lights and sun are two different things.
According to the Bible, light existed before matter. According to the big bang light got into existence after the matter (300000yrs)
then it still fits.
that it's likely?
In a way, yes.
then prove it
u mean expanding instantly or very quickly.
I can prove its likely but until Revelations it won't be proven.
when you pump a balloon
Can you prove God exists?
I never gave that arguement so I didn't answer those questions because there is no reason.
describe what u mean by a balloon.
click replied to button to see what points
Big bang isn't described as an istant boom, it wasn't even an explosion. Big bang was like a ballon. The light has occurred 300000 years after the big bang.
the big bang is described as an instant boom. much life if a God said let there be light... God's a different being than us do u think he counts time the same? depending how far u believe in evolution but even then u could argue that just like evolution animals were the clay for our mold. what points?
some things are eternal and they exist forever.
Evolution without a big bang cannot occur. Also the first few days God couldn't make animals because animals evolved for billion of years. And God couldn't create humans because humans were created by animals. Also, what about other things I've said?
not really. evolution could simply be a tool.
but it is contradictable surf Christianity
I didn't say that and I disagree with ur evolution statement.
neveralone, I know you don't have evidence of god's existence. But then you ask me "Can you prove he doesn't exist"...
1) How can I disprove something unproven?
2) By that logic we should believe in everything? unproven (Zeus, unicorns, superman...)
3) 1% of people in Africa who evolved to be immune to AIDS is proof of evolution and evolution is contradictable with religion.
4) Can you prove Zeus doesn't exist?
No defending the assumption that nonexistence is the default state?
there's nothing contradictory between those 2.
If i were to make an argument against the likelihood of the existence of god I would cite the recent developments in the research of the physics of "empty" space. Its far from empty and is bustling with quantum activity.
it appears that a vacuum is not nature's default state and nature actually abhors a vacuum. a vacuum is an extremely high energy state and the existence of matter is the lower energy state nature craves.
the point is that religion treats existence as some unlikely event when it appears increasingly to be the default state or things. why do we assume that without a creator nothingness will be the default.
of course nothing appears to be the logical default but with the discovery that nothing is far from empty, existence isn't just likely, it is a necessity.
so there's a reason he is not omnipotent, because he's omniscient
can he learn without throwing out his knowledge?
this is an endless debate. My frustration is the identical point, not that the overall debate is long.
this is the ultimate debate.
I feel the same If were still doing this at two thousand post then I'm going to other debates because this will go on forever at this rate.
haven't checked in here in a while.
once again, not having a flaw does not take away from perfection.
if the reason one can't learn is because they already know everything, that's not a flaw.
1000 posts later, same argument.
technically he could plausably repress knowledge to learn it again but there would be no sense in that.
I'm not asking you why, I'm asking can he?
why would God need to learn something?
I can learn. God can't since he's omniscient.
unless he thought the price was too high
that would technically go against the all powerful thing.
I meant something God can't do even if he wants to
u can sin. logically he can't since sin is directly against his will
Can I do something God can't? (something what doesn't fit his nature)?
God doesn't plan anyone to fail. u choose to go off the path can u blame God that it doesn't? work out?
And God planned we'll fail. Why?
no it isn't. we have a purpose here but we can fail to do it. each one is different.
many criminals are Muslim and Christian because the laws of a state are different with laws of holly book
death is not filling life purpose
No criminal wants to die and go where false god police have no power.
They say there is no God so they can substitute police instead.
They say there is no heaven, so they can substitute Earth instead.
there is a difference between dieing without filling ur purpose and dieing after u have. life's purpose isn't death.
then why did you say not filling life purpose (death) isn't bad?
because they may not have filled their lives purpose yet.
why do you pray for them not to die if death isn't bad?
which is where it becomes obvious that God hand was in the situation. there is actually a hilarious movie that has (a little) bit of what happened in it. I believe it's Evan Almighty. though Bruce Almighty is good too and may actually help u understand God while getting plenty of laughs.
I pray for many things. why do we die?
Also, do you really believe 2 penguines walked all the way from Antarctica to the middle east to get abroad an ark built by a 500 year old man?
then why? are you praying for starving children?
death isn't evil in itself. it is an event that must happen. would u say puberty is evil?
30k of kids die every day
we help those kids all the time. it's our fault their lives are messed up not God's. churches and other donators help them all the time.
he abandoned starving children in Africa
well the books we are fairly sure who wrote them by tracing as best as we can. on God's guidance he never has abandon us.
several books and God's guidance...
how do u know that?
the Bible itself? no it's multiple writings that was put together I believe after Jesus died. before then it was several books and God's guidance.
Did Bible even exist before the flood?
he showed himself throughout the bible.if he is all knowing then he knows every way and believed this way was best. could u say ur all knowing?
Road to 2k xddd
A God is evil because he killed them all and didn't find better solution, like to show himself maybe?
u did read the part where the earth was filled with evil right? babies more than likely weren't killed. there's no mention of children and even bigger point the Bible directly said the world was filled with evil. not innocence.
If flooding all world including innocent babies isn't evil, I don't know what is.
he hasn't done anything evil.
he has done more evil than good
not doing something suddenly does something? you seem very interested in trying to get God to be evil when he has done so much good.
He didn't make a one choice become a choice and he made evil because he didn't do that.
he could but God doesn't do contradictions. he's got this world set up with reason and logic. what goes up must come down,ect.
Can God make one choice become a choice?
not really no. it teaches that we have all sinned and as such no one just gets in. Jesus is the only way.
wrong! Bible teaches that non-Christians should be executed.
it's not wether it good or bad it's more about if u still have sin or not.
hmm interesting. if it is like a program that could very well be true if such a choice has a determined outcome. but these are a lot of programs (people) to sift through. though God could do it I believe he has a more loose control over it so that it could truly be choice. like if a programmer made just the if and left the then to the program to go through and watched and sometimes made small corrections.
If God can't make one choice become a choice, he's not all powerful.
u don't understand choice. with only one choice it's not a choice.
This is how God works (I included pseudo code because I don't have much time...)
And God doesn't even check the probability "Is atheist a good person?" or "Is Christian a bad person?" and thats not perfect like God should be.
That is the entire point. If God is the ultimate programmer, he knew how things would go before starting things in motion. That means, by setting the conditions for the choice, he has determined the outcome.
Yes, the people could try to move out of the way. Do you believe God wouldn't know which way they would move, or is he not responsible for pushing the rock that he knows will kill people?
Programs can decided things now. We set up an "if/then" line that gives them criteria. The flaw in that removing responsibility is that it was still set in motion intentionally. For example, a virus could make a decision like "if someone has money in their bank account, then transfer that money into my account". Is the programmer innocent since the program chose which was the right answer? God set every variable, meaning if you have to chose whether to turn left or right, he set up everything that would ever influence that decision. You may make the choice, but since he knew what his creation would cause you to decide, that choice is already determined.
U really don't understand "all powerful"... God could give u only good and u could still have free will.
on the program one if it can truly choose then the program could be at fault depending on if God asked (it?) to or if it did itself.
why did they just stand there? theoretically if he did that would be God but a stone can't make that choice.
in a way God is the ultimate programmer haha
u do realize that there are only two choices only? good or evil. though neutral is technically a choice in mundane things the important stuff only has these two.
certain parts are most certainly set. that's why there's phrophcies all over the Bible. but if we're talking about Revelations then that can literally be anywhere. please read it sometime so u can have a better understanding
He is still somehow not sure if future is set...
The problem I have with the argument that God gave us a choice and we chose evil is that God is described as all knowing and all powerful. That means he knew the consequences of every action he made when creating the world. If he knew everything that would ever happen, he would know that a slight difference in creationism would change the outcome and chose to make it as it is.
Compare that to someone writing a program that does exactly what they want. The program can make decisions based on experience and input, but the programmer is responsible for what it does. If someone created a computer program that shut down power to a major city, could they claim that it chose to?
A simpler analogy is that God started a rock rolling down a hill when he created the world. He can claim that the rock chose to roll over some people and not others, but if he knew exactly where it would go when he pushed, he chose to kill those people.
Jesus didn't die for our sins:
HE COULD GIVE ME CHOICE BUT NOT ABILITY TO DO EVIL. Unless he's not all powerful!
Future is set. If Bible supports renewing earth (future) then it's set.
because God gave u choice he is evil? so saving billions of billions of lives don't matter? or creating those lives? or resurrecting people? or sending his son to die for u? or giving u a chance to live a righteous life? all that suddenly doesn't matter because he gave u choice? which is something most would cherish.
that is Revelations. that is not the entirety of that story either if u read on u would come to where God renews the earth and we live their with Him.
Mathew 25:46 for hell
Mathew 5:17-20 for heaven
1) God can do everything
2) God could make humans without ability to do evil but with free will. And not become a dictator or hypocrate...
3) God didn't do that.
4) God is evil.
Also, u always said "they are now in heaven!"(for babies), and u say that for them today. There's more then 144000 victims so they aren't all in heaven. Where's the justice for those who went to hell?
how "they don't watch us" has to do with that? They don't have to, they don't know ANYTHING. Quote the Bible anywhere, were it says that dead go to heaven or hell.
that seems more like a statement. power and morals don't have a correlation besides argueable corruption. Hitler certainly had morals but to us they were messed up. but so did JFK but he tried what he thought was good as well and is usually looked on as a great person. unless ur Cuba,Russia, or the mob.
because they don't watch us and get prizes? that seems far fetch. especially since heaven and hell are both everywhere in the Bible.
I don't have credit card if I even need it.. nvm
click "replied to" button
If dead know nothing and there's no reward for them, therefore they don't exist.
Get this post off
u can check it out on YouTube. it cost 4 bucks though.
or spiritual. idk but the Bible never says he invisible. theoretically I see no reason why he couldn't be space per say
idk which question can u ask it again?
u misunderstood. it's talking about on earth. u see we believe that the only ghost is the holy ghost. the dead have no reason to be with the living.
could u provide a link?
if he's not invisible and he's everywhere he's one word: space
no, now answer me on question (click"replied to"button few times)
So they're slaves (robots) in heaven and hell because they don't know nothing anymore? If they know nothing, they're not concious and if they are souls, therefore souls aren't concious.
it was midnight u think those people are wide awake. also did u see the documentary?
well he isn't really invisible as much as not physical.
figuring out what someone will say next.
it says they know nothing and get no reward. there isn't a reward system once ur dead u either go to heaven or hell.
what? Also, why wouldn't u prove god's existence?
It's a lie. It's a legend. First of all, their parents would ask them where are they going. But hey I'll make theories:
3) Negative energy forced his dreams to change.
4) He's a liar.
5) He didn't dream that, his friend warned him because he saw enemy.
6) Why would God allow the rest of village to be burnt down and everyone die?
Anyone can debate he'll never make me stop believing in his words.
I'm not finding excuses to anyone
I asked how, because he is invisible, all knowing,all powerful and omnipresent creature that is supposed to do good but it doesn't.
"The dead know more nothing"
"There's no more reward for them"
means afterlife doesn't exist. After that, it says dead people are forgotten.
man tell me about this one. there is a guy in Africa. when he was a boy he was dreaming when God came to him. God told him he must get out of his village immeaditly. so he woke up and was heading out when his friend say him and went with him. when they got out of the village they looked back and saw that there village was attacked and burned down to the ground. that were the only survivors. he still hears God today and if u want proof watch father of light.
ok now I understand what ur talking about. no I mean I wanted to know who is debating for the Christians for that because it was very weak arguements.
words of anger apologies. well u are trying to do good so I'll give u points on that.haha
apologies I seem to have read between the lines. though I don't recall u asking anyone.in a way I warped what u said but when u first started here u said u couldn't believe anyone could believe in God today and it insults me because I do.
that's what that's about?
it states that people forget the dead.
I am not making up anything. If it isn't proven it doesn't mean it's not true.
lol, and how am I doing it for a perfect being?
I never said u have low iq, I just asked because I asked everyone. I didn't say u r troll I just assumed. When did I call religion a joke and how that insults u?
did logical chain help u? It does not even have to be logical (it is), u can predict what am I going to say so do it until u r not sure
It witnesses heaven and hell don't exist.
some cases not all but good try.
not really I'm not even sure what ur trying to say herw
excuses? the only one doing that is u
well insinuating low iq(it's not btw but no I'm not giving such info online) and calling of a troll are certainly personal attacks and of course calling a religion a joke is to name a few
none of what u r saying is logical.
I could do all those things and not be a dictator
It's scientifically proven. It's like NDE when u see God, heaven, light, Jesus...
I am making something that's not proven up? Does that sound familiar to u?
do u know what a dictator is because u most certainly would be one
and that is why we are having difficulty. u refuse to take a different perspective therefore all arguement is empty
What personal attacks? I think u r troll because u r searching for excuses to an perfect being (so logical)
I mean the people else I would say ur making them up.
I could make it right.
Do logicals conclusions please, I am tired of this type of explaining.
u do not need to know my iq. just because I disagree with ur arguement does not make a troll. I would stay away from personal attacks else u would become the real.
Help: Eccle 9:5 (read it)
I want u to quote that.
that does not make them right. else Hitler is a martyr and black people should be slaves
I could do all those things and not be a dictator.
yes, of course
that is Revelations. though I'm glad u read it u misunderstood it. which seems a common theme.
No, I as a believer in his word don't need evidence. I believe in that. Evidence of his words: He said he is male so that makes his words true.
(Does it seem kinda familiar to u?)
what people believe and what is are two different things.
I wonder what's ur iq, I always want to know what info with people I'm talking to. U seem like a troll xd
so u think something outside ur body trying to contact u (or not try to be different)would feel exactly like ur subconscious?
I could make morals with power
People that are in heaven now. Also Bible says only 144000 people will go to heaven and victims of those evil things are much bigger numbers of that so ur argument fails.
I perfectly understand all powerful. u misconceive that since u r all powerful u must fling it around without a care in the world.
If I couldn't make them stop believing I'm a dictator I am not all powerful.
could u cite some.
no u can't. noone can in those situations
that is the most corrupt statement I have heard and wasn't very logical. morals are not made with power.
they most definitely would. u can literally pick a random person and tell them that u are going to take choice out of the equation but still give u free will and they would look upon u as a dictator God.
what's ur iq (just asking)?
Because u don't understand what "all powerful" means. Answer with yes or no:
Can God make contradictions stop contradicting each other?
haha I'm glad u know exactly all there is about God and Jesus and the subconscious. I can easily tell the difference between the two.
did this help u?
yes they were professional...
again no. he could force u but then u are a slave and it really doesn't matter what words u use the life wouldn't be ur own
I mean professional. the answers given were weak at best. it sounds like he just picked up people off the street.
Hitler couldn't manipulate other people minds like I could. (It wouldn't be evil because I would be all powerful).
Where does Bible strictly say people like that are in heaven? Also if they died because evil and now they're in heaven, evil still exists.
do u think Hitler thought he was evil? how about Khan? or NK? No one believes themselves to be evil but without guidance anyone can.
If i would? be all powerful, those people won't think I'm a dictator. Why do I have to tell u those things, u can also do logical conclusions...
ur laughing about that? he is in heaven, getting food from churches and other help organizations, UN, really the weather? the news is getting better and better at predicting them, all will get justice.
No, it's not. The Jesus u r talking about is ur subconscious.
Then God isn't all powerful because he can't make contradictions stop contradictong each other.
God is out of the loop of a lot of things.
yes they were, what kind of question is that?
maybe in ur mind but definitely not in theirs. u would become a dictator and they would try to overthrow u every chance they get.
Maybe this chain logic would help u understand the term 'all powerful' (only facts):
1) I am all powerful
2) I can do literally everything
3) I can make contradictions stop contradicting each other
4) I can make evil and good be the same
5) I can do evil and not be evil
6) I can make a square circle
7) If I can make contradictions stop contradicting each other then I can pull away ability from people to do evil and still leave them free will.
8) Then I can feel free love without a source
9) I can stop evil and leave humans free will
10) I am all powerful (If I can't do those things, I am not all powerful therefore I can do all those things. I am beyond ur understanding. Dont put me in box I can't fit.)
no. it's two separate things. Jesus is very much different than ur subconscious.
it still would be. no matter what u do a circle and square together will always contradict. now God has done things that do contradict natural law but when it comes to reasoning or what we believe it's the same no matter how many times God makes a square circles it will always contradict.
well then it is a different matter but not all together. were any of these people actual Christian debaters?
Since I would be all powerful, I would make me do all these things and not become evil.
what about that little kid who drowned, starving child in Africa, wars, tsunamis, earthquakes, vulcano eruptions, robbers, murders, homeless people and so on.....?
When u refer to anyone, that excludes God?
no, I would be all powerful! People would still have choices.
Square circle is also a contradiction!!!
Since I would be all powerful it wouldn't be a contradiction.
real life = rl
by doing so u have become evil. there is no misconception.
he has already has beaten evil.
God isn't just anyone
then u have taken choice
two separate things
u would make a contradiction
u said rl and the first thing that came up was a newspaper
making people with free will but not slaves does stop evil because they wouldn't have ability to do evil. What's ur misconception with this?
no one can do that means God can't do that which means he's not all powerful.
I would make it we can choose but we would not have ability to do evil.
Jesus (ur subconscious)
I would do that without slaves, since I would be all powerful.
wtf, no! He argued with preachers and other Christians...
true but debating as one can help ur arguments dramatically?.
making circle squares and people without free will but are not slaves stops evil?
I mean I don't understand what u were saying there.
make it to where we cant choose? without that choice there are chains bringing u down depending on ur definition of evil. I could say that doing anything besides going to work going home and sleeping is evil. now no one can do that. would that not become problematic? u can't beat perfection and I don't expect u to. though I will help make a better plan.
we are both mixed up on this. what parlor trick?
u think having slaves is a better solution? when u want to know someone and vise versa do u not want it to be an honest event?
he got it from a magazine?
lol, I am not an adult officialy xd
but that doesn't change anything.
"I would use it for useful things instead of RETARDED things"and I'm talking about stopping evil. It's a logical conclusion.
If God can do everything, it makes sense.
Why didn't he do that? It's mine solution and it's better than God's. With my solution everything would be the same except people wouldn't have ability to do evil. I am not perfect, how is possible that I got better solution then a perfect being? Does it make u question ur religion?
What reply are u talking about? I thought we r talking about parlor trick.
Then why didn't he do that? He did worse solution then mine and people still have ability to do evil.
I never said that. please be an adult and debate what I say not stuff I haven't said.
none of that statement made sense
I didn't say he can't I said it's ridiculous.
that wasn't my reply
he is all powerful so theoretically yes but the idea is ridiculous
where did he get them?
U just said stopping evil would be retarded. lol
Hahahahahah u said world needs reason and logic!!!! Come with urself!
U r running of the topic, click replied to button few times and then reply
He can't do ridicules things? U just admitted he can't do contradictions.
I didn't ask u that. I asked can he?
He picked all debates he had
the why is one of the most useful questions. if there is no reason God doesn't do it. if I could hold my breath that long I am not doing it as party tricks I would use it for useful things instead of retarded things.
he can and be retarded but the world needs reason and logic.
again it's a contradiction and ridiculous.
why? why in the world would he there is no reason it's ridiculous.
he gave the answer to his opponents. depends on who and what. those are weak debates so at best he picked the weak ones to attack.
Why would he make square circle?
It's not about why, it's about can he. It's like if ur friend tells u to hold breath for 30 minutes, and u tell him u don't want to do that because it's unnecessary (hint: u can't do that).
then what is?
So God can't dk retundand ideas?